View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | View Status | Date Submitted | Last Update |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0000026 | Pax Fax | Pax Fax | public | 2025-04-05 07:33 | 2025-09-22 15:02 |
| Reporter | titanium | Assigned To | |||
| Priority | high | Severity | block | Reproducibility | always |
| Status | new | Resolution | open | ||
| Summary | 0000026: Phaxio api and dashboard no longer exist for new users. They have been assimilated into Sinch. | ||||
| Description | There is no way to get access to a Phaxio dashboard anymore, it has been moved to the Sinch dashboard now. The api/documentation is now different. https://developers.sinch.com/docs/fax/v2-v3migration/ Some instructions for the Pax Fax app seem to be similar: For the "Phaxio API Key" and "Phaxio API Secret" I put the Key/Secret from Sinch. However, for the "Phaxio Webhook Token" it instructs to go to the Phaxio account, click 'Webhooks' on the left panel, then copy the token found under 'Webhook Token'. There seems to be no corresponding Webhooks section on Sinch. Where to get a Sinch webhook that will work with Pax Fax? Same question goes for the Phaxio Callback URL - what to replace it with? Much appreciated. | ||||
| Steps To Reproduce | Go to https://developers.sinch.com/docs/fax/v2-v3migration/ If you attempt to register by pressing sign up on https://console.phaxio.com/sf_guard_users/sign_in - it redirects you to https://sinch.com/apis/fax-api/ You can register on the new dashboard here - https://dashboard.sinch.com/signup | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
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I've just tested logging in to phaxio.com and sending and receiving faxes from Pax Fax. Everything works as usual. Existing phaxio.com accounts work as expected with Pax Fax. Yet, what you mention above is perfectly true: when a new customer tries to open a new phaxio.com account, he is redirected to sinch.com and if he signs up for a new account there, he finds a new dashboard, where he can't find many of the fields that existed on Phaxio's dashboard, such as the 'Webhook Token' field. According to this page: https://developers.sinch.com/docs/fax/v2-v3migration/ it seems that phaxio.com accounts will have to migrate to sinch.com accounts and all the apps that connected to phaxio.com will have to transition to connecting to sinch.com, with all the necessary changes imposed by their API. Sinch's dashboard loads very slowly and seems unintuitive and Phaxio should have informed their existing customers about the upcoming transition, therefore, I'll have to investigate further and decide if I change Pax Fax to connect to sinch.com, or renounce to phaxio/sinch entirely and connect Pax Fax to other better and cheaper fax provider, such as Telnyx. |
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Thank you for taking a quick look. I see, it's good that it still works for people with existing Phaxio accounts for the time being. That being said, as you have seen, this makes Pax Fax unusable for new people. I need to let my team know whether we can expect to use Pax Fax in the near future, or whether we need to let go of our idea of using Nextcloud for faxing. For us, it doesn't matter if it will be Telnyx or Sinch, just as long as Pax Fax will begin working. Can you please provide a rough estimate of whether it will take you just a few weeks or perhaps many months to make the modification to the Pax Fax app? That way I can bring something back to my team. Thanks again! |
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I've asked Phaxio about this transition to Sinch's API that they didn't announce, and I'm waiting their reply tomorrow. I remember that Telnyx has discontinued basic authentication for HTTP requests to their API, which makes receiving faxes from them inside Nextcloud impossible. Many years ago, when I chose Phaxio as fax provider for Pax Fax, they were the best provider because they offered reliable services at the cheapest price possible: $2 per month for a phone number and 7 cents per sent and received page. All the other providers, like eFax, myFax, iFax, Fax.Plus etc. had a much higher monthly ongoing cost, like $10, or more. Why should a small business pay $10 or more each month just to be able to send a few faxes per year? Meanwhile, Telnyx added faxing to their voice and SMS services and they became 'the best provider' but as I mentioned, they can't be used to receive faxes inside Nextcloud. So, Phaxio remains a good choice for Pax Fax. Yet, sooner or later all apps will have to transition to Sinch's API. According to this page: https://sinch.com/apis/fax-api/ , a fax page will cost only 4.5 cents, as opposed to 7 cents with Phaxio. A US fax enabled number will cost $0.88 per month, as opposed to $2 per month with Phaxio. So, if Sinch's API is as reliable as Phaxio's and if their dashboard gets a bit faster, Sinch seems actually better than Phaxio. Since I consider being able to send and receive faxes inside Nextcloud very important, I plan to change Pax Fax to make it support both API's, in the sense that I'll add a new section on the Settings page, where each new user will enter his Sinch credentials in order to use them to send and receive faxes connecting to Sinch's API, while old users will continue to use their Phaxio credentials on the Settings page to send and receive faxes as usual, until they find the time to port their phone numbers from Phaxio to Sinch. Also, the documentation will have to change, to show users where to find the necessary credentials on Sinch's dashboard. I can't tell exactly how much time the code changes will take, since it also depends on other factors, such as on Sinch's support response time, but it definitely shouldn't take too long. I suppose about two weeks. I'll post a reply on this thread once I finish. |
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Great, thank you. I appreciate the details and that you will attempt to get it done fairly quickly. We'll be waiting! Cheers |
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Pax Fax version 1.1.9 has been published. After you upgrade, enter your Sinch credentials on the Settings page. You can test by sending a one page pdf file to your own number. As I was expecting, Sinch support delayed this new version quite a bit. |
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Thanks! Will check it out soon. |
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Have you tried entering your Sinch credentials on the Pax Fax' Settings page and sending a test fax to your number ? |
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I was able to test the connection with Sinch, that portion seemed to work, so that's great already. I am waiting to hear from my colleague who will be testing sending and receiving a fax. I'll let you know as soon as I hear back from him. Thanks for all this. |
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Hi, thank you for your patience, I finally got it setup with the other person from the team. However, when attaching a file to send, whether by upload or by choosing an existing nextcloud file, a browser alert pops up saying "Error!". When trying to upload again, it keeps endlessly spinning and saying "uploading". Is this a known bug? |
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Additionally, if I ignore that error and press "Send fax" it says "Error ! Please check your settings !" - although the settings appear to be correct, and I was able to receive a test fax from Sinch. Probably that error is due to the file upload error. |
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I can't reproduce your error because everything works fine here. When you try to upload a file from your computer to send it as fax, what error do you see in your Nextcloud log (Administration settings > Logging). Also, after you upload a file, do you see it saved in the "/Pax_Fax/temp_files" folder of your Nextcloud ? Any details about your Nextcloud installation would be relevant: have you installed it directly on the server, as advised in our guide, or are you using the Docker All-in-One installation ? What web server and what MariaDB version ? |
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Also, if you log in via SSH to your server and inspect your Nextcloud installation folder, do you see the "pax_fax" directory in "nextcloud_root_directory/apps" or in "nextcloud_root_directory/custom_apps" ? ("nextcloud_root_directory" can be "/var/www/cloud.example.com" or something similar, depending on your setup) |
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So, this is what it says: UnexpectedValueException FilesystemIterator::__construct(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files): Failed to open directory: No such file or directory However when I go to All Files>Pax_Fax>temp_files - I do see the folder and the files that I tried to upload. That being said, our nextcloud is configured to use remote s3 storage. We do not use on-server storage ( as indicated in the /var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files link). This s3 connection is properly configured with nextcloud, and we have been uploading and sharing files for a few years now. Perhaps PaxFax doesn't take into account the possibility of a s3 setup? |
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To answer your other questions, we have installed nextcloud directly, we are not using docker. Ubuntu 24.04 LTS. MariaDB 10.11.11 Nginx Yes there is a pax_fax folder in /apps And I double checked - there is no pax_fax folder in nextcloud/data/username/files - because its in s3. |
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Here is the related portion of our nextcloud config 'objectstore' => array ( 'class' => '\\OC\\Files\\ObjectStore\\S3', 'arguments' => array ( CONNECTION INFO HERE - bucket, key, secret, hostname, port, region, use_ssl, autocreate ), ), |
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From your Nextcloud error it's quite clear: the "FilesystemIterator" class, which is used whenever you upload or pick a file to send as fax, cannot operate on the "/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files" directory, although the directory exists, because it's not stored on local storage, but, as you mentioned, on remote storage. Your issue is somewhat similar to this issue: https://help.nextcloud.com/t/cannot-share-files-or-folders-with-objectstorage/150931 although I perfectly understand that you can share files and folders in your setup, you just can't upload files with Pax Fax. In fact, the files get uploaded to the "/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files" directory, since you can see them there, but you get that popup error and the Nextcloud error with the "FilesystemIterator" class not finding that directory where the files are stored until they are sent as fax. Please upload a one page pdf file in Pax Fax to send as fax and then, in spite of the popup error, while logged in to your server via SSH, rescan all the files by running: cd /var/www/nextcloud sudo -u www-data php occ files:scan --all Then try sending the fax to your own fax number. |
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Also, do you have the following line in your '/var/www/nextcloud/config/config.php' file: 'datadirectory' => '/var/www/nextcloud/data', |
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Well I can see the files I uploaded to Pax Fax in nextcloud, and that command didn't do anything - 0 folders 0 files 0 new 0 updated 0 removed 0 errors. This time I tried both selecting an existing file from nextcloud and uploading the file again. And I ran the provided command multiple times. After pressing Send it says "Error ! Please check your settings !" Below is the list of errors, starting at the bottom. The first ones are me trying to select an existing file from nextcloud. Error index UnexpectedValueException FilesystemIterator::__construct(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files): Failed to open directory: No such file or directory May 29, 2025, 11:23:31 PM Error index Exception base64_encode(): Argument #1 ($string) must be of type string, false given in file '/var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php' line 554 May 29, 2025, 11:23:29 PM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/faxes_sent/Test fax__18553301239_2025-05-29_14-23-28_897470.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#554 May 29, 2025, 11:23:29 PM Error index Exception base64_encode(): Argument #1 ($string) must be of type string, false given in file '/var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php' line 554 May 29, 2025, 11:23:29 PM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/faxes_sent/Test fax__18553301239_2025-05-29_14-23-28_897470.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#554 May 29, 2025, 11:23:29 PM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Test fax.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#546 May 29, 2025, 11:23:28 PM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Test fax.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#546 May 29, 2025, 11:23:28 PM Error index UnexpectedValueException FilesystemIterator::__construct(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files): Failed to open directory: No such file or directory May 29, 2025, 11:21:38 PM Error index UnexpectedValueException FilesystemIterator::__construct(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files): Failed to open directory: No such file or directory May 29, 2025, 11:21:38 PM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Test fax.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#400 May 29, 2025, 11:21:37 PM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Test fax.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#400 May 29, 2025, 11:21:37 PM |
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and yes, 'datadirectory' => '/var/www/nextcloud/data', is part of the config file |
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You can also check if your " 'objectstore' => ... " entry in your "config.php" file is similar to the one described in the first post of this issue: https://github.com/nextcloud/server/issues/34407 . Also, in your Nextcloud database, does your 'oc_mounts' table specify "OC\Files\Mount\ObjectHomeMountProvider" in the "mount_provider_class" column on the row where "user_id" is your username, as suggested in this issue: https://github.com/nextcloud/server/issues/25781#issuecomment-1383091969 ? Or do you see "OC\Files\Mount\LocalHomeMountProvider" in that field ? |
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From the error you have posted it's clear that some common PHP functions, like "file_get_contents", cannot operate on the path given: "/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Test fax.pdf". So, the file is there, but the function fails to get the file content. This must be caused by the remote storage you are using. All Pax Fax users who use local storage don't experience this issue. Why do you have a space in your test file name ("Test fax.pdf"). Spaces can create problems in file paths. Please use "test_fax.pdf". |
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Yes the entry is similar but not entirely the same. for example, I have this set to true, instead of false: 'autocreate' => true, As for your other question, for all 30 users except for 2 accounts, it was set to "OC\Files\Mount\ObjectHomeMountProvider". The two accounts which it was set to OC\Files\Mount\LocalHomeMountProvider were the admin user and another user. I was using the admin user account to try faxing, however another user which was also running into the same issues had it set properly to "OC\Files\Mount\ObjectHomeMountProvider". In any case, I updated the admin user to have it set to "OC\Files\Mount\ObjectHomeMountProvider" yet the same problem persists with the same errors.. |
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I am guessing this is because it is trying to access the file and folder that does not exist on the server. I understand that this works for people who use local storage, however we don't use local storage, and that is likely the main issue here. We haven't had any issues with other apps that we use - file uploads, file sharing, realtime file collaboration, forms, deck - everything has been pretty consistent and working good for a few years for all 30 users. This is the first time we run into an issue related to the fact that we're set up with remote storage. From the data that I have, I assume that the config that we have should be correct, and the programming of this app tries to access the absolute path on the server, instead of the relative path to the remote storage? By the way, I renamed the file, and its the same problem - Error index UnexpectedValueException FilesystemIterator::__construct(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files): Failed to open directory: No such file or directory May 30, 2025, 12:37:59 AM Error index Exception base64_encode(): Argument #1 ($string) must be of type string, false given in file '/var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php' line 554 May 30, 2025, 12:37:57 AM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/faxes_sent/Testfax__12132942943_2025-05-29_15-37-54_720388.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#554 May 30, 2025, 12:37:57 AM Error PHP file_get_contents(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Testfax.pdf): Failed to open stream: No such file or directory at /var/www/nextcloud/apps/pax_fax/lib/Controller/PaxfaxController.php#546 May 30, 2025, 12:37:54 AM Error index UnexpectedValueException FilesystemIterator::__construct(/var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files): Failed to open directory: No such file or directory May 30, 2025, 12:37:49 AM |
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from what im reading in the app code it seems to be using the config.php datadirectory parameter, which is $datadir = $this->config->getSystemValue('datadirectory', \OC::$SERVERROOT . '/data') . '/'; which means that is is trying to access the data from the directory on the server where it doesn't exist. If I'm correct then perhaps this should account for object storage? https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/latest/admin_manual/configuration_files/primary_storage.html |
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So, in your Nextcloud installation, when you go to All files > Pax_Fax > temp_files, you say that you can see there the file that you have uploaded to send as fax: Testfax.pdf. Yet, if you are logged in via SSH to your server and try to open that file by running: nano /var/www/nextcloud/data/username/files/Pax_Fax/temp_files/Testfax.pdf you get "No such file or directory" ? If this is the case, where does your S3 storage get mounted ? |
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Yes, no such directory. It is not mounted on the server like a normal disk, it is remote storage. Here is a quote from the nextcloud documentation "The Simple Storage Service (S3) backend mounts a bucket on an Amazon S3 object storage or compatible implementation (e.g. Minio or Ceph Object Gateway) into the virtual filesystem." The files in the s3 storage are not normal files with the same name, which you can access directly. they are converted into files with these names: urn:oid:10042 urn:oid:11075 urn:oid:10928 urn:oid:10580 urn:oid:11052 urn:oid:1106 Nextcloud manages them via the database, where it keeps record of which of these weirdly named files is responsible for what actual file with what permissions. Overall, I can summarize that this is expected nextcloud behavior, and I didn't do anything out of the ordinary - I followed official nextcloud instructions and set up remote storage per their documentation. https://docs.nextcloud.com/server/latest/admin_manual/configuration_files/primary_storage.html The interesting thing is that although the PaxFax app uploads the file into temp_files correctly, and I can see it there before I press send - when I hit send, it gets transferred into the "faxes_sent" directory, however at that point the file loses all data, and becomes a 0kb .pdf |
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Ok, I think I'll replace the "FilesystemIterator" class and the "file_get_contents()" function with something that works with local storage but also with remote storage. Also, I'll change the way the file paths are constructed, to accomodate the remote storage situation. I'll post again here when finished. |
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Ok, thank you! |
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I have just published Pax Fax version 1.2.0, which addresses all the problems discussed above. When you have the time please test it. |
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Hi there. Great, thank you! I just tested it and the file upload (and file choice from nextcloud) as well as fax sending seem to work great now. I will ask the team member to test it as well, to see if he runs into any problems. And then we will also test potentially receiving faxes to see if that works well too. I'll keep you posted. Thanks again. |
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Hi, the team member was able to send faxes as well now, so all good. They wont be having a need to receive faxes for the near future, so we wont be testing that for now. Thank you again for your help with making this work. |
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When you have the time, please consider sending a fax to your own number to confirm if you can receive faxes also. It's possible that you will want to receive faxes in the future. If you send a fax to your own number the file is actually sent to Sinch and Sinch treats it as a regular fax sent by a regular sender. After processing it, Sinch sends it to Pax Fax, so, you should receive it like any other fax. If you have already entered the callback URL in your Sinch account (as instructed on the app's settings page, under "Sinch callback URL"), all you have to do is to choose your number in the "Set ID" field, then enter the same number in the destination box, then choose the file you want to send and click Send. Then, in about one minute, you should see a Nextcloud notification about a recently received fax and if you click the "Received faxes" button you should see the received fax as a pdf file. You can also send a free fax to your fax number from a service like gotfreefax.com . |
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Hi, we don't have an available ID in the set ID field, because we haven't purchased a phone number on Sinch. As such, we can't receive faxes without paying for purchasing a phone number. |
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Ok, I see. Yet, after spending the $2 of your trial account you will need a fax number to send and receive faxes. I find Sinch more convenient than Phaxio because to rent a fax number from Sinch costs around $0.9 per month for an American/Canadian number, whereas with Phaxio, the same number would cost $2 per month. This is the only ongoing monthly cost. It will cost more only if you actually send or receive faxes. In USA and Canada it's $0.045 per sent or received page (as opposed to Phaxio where it's $0.07 per sent/received page). |
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Yeah the costs are nice with Sinch. I will follow up with the team - they will likely want to upgrade and add a phone number after they test this in real world application with the trial balance. |
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Hello there, There is another issue that might be related to this new Sinch integration. Sending individual taxes still works fine, however we started attempting batch sends of anywhere between 12-15 faxes at the same time. The problem is that while Nextcloud says that it has been sent, Sinch only receives and processes the first number in the list - all the other numbers in the string are nowhere to be found. Here is an example of what our string looks like: 11231231231,11231231232,11231231233,11231231234,11231231235,11231231236,11231231237,11231231238,11231231239,11231231230 No quotation marks, no spaces, only commas between. Nextcloud is showing one kind of error whenever such a send is attempted (multiple such errors per batch send attempt) - Error richdocuments ClientException Client error: `POST https://ournextcloudinstance.com/cool/convert-to/png` resulted in a `413 Request Entity Too Large` response: <html> <head><title>413 Request Entity Too Large</title></head> <body> <center><h1>413 Request Entity Too Large</h1>< (truncated...) Failed to convert preview: Client error: `POST https://ournextcloudinstance.com/cool/convert-to/png` resulted in a `413 Request Entity Too Large` response: <html> <head><title>413 Request Entity Too Large</title></head> <body> <center><h1>413 Request Entity Too Large</h1>< (truncated...) This error doesn't seem like its related to the code not delivering the rest of the numbers in the string to Sinch, but rather is related to generation some preview pic of the resulting fax. However, I thought its important to show it regardless. Please review this issue and hopefully fix the multiple fax sending through Sinch. Thank you! |
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I'll look into this problem and run some tests with multiple numbers. To state this issue more clearly: you have tried to send the same fax document to multiple recipients and not multiple faxes. Multiple faxes would mean multiple different documents. Instead you sent the same document to multiple different numbers and only the first number received the fax. |
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Yes, we're using one pdf with 3 pages. It is one file, sent to multiple different numbers. |
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Are you using the same test number offered by Sinch to try their services, or have you bought a real fax number to test sending faxes to single and multiple recipients ? |
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We recharged our account balance with Sinch some time ago, and we are still using the default number. We haven't purchased any specific number, as Sinch didn't require us to, no. |
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I've published version 1.2.1 of Pax Fax, which solves the problem mentioned above. Please update Pax Fax and send a test page to 3 different numbers first. Then, you can send to 10 or more numbers. You can send the test page to the free fax number mentioned here: https://www.gotfreefax.com/free-fax-number , where you can see the received fax. You can also send to your own number. Then please mention the result on this thread. While Phaxio specifies at the end of this page: https://www.phaxio.com/docs/api/v2/faxes/create_and_send_fax that with a number rented from them a user can send to up to 15 numbers at once, there is no similar information on Sinch's website. I've sent a support request to Sinch asking them to clarify the maximum number of recipients for one fax call and the price per page for international faxes. To/from USA and Canada it seems it's $0.045 per page. |
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Thank you, I will review and test it today. |
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Hi there, It looks great, thank you. I was able to send 30 faxes simultaneously. I will attempt 50 faxes tomorrow, and perhaps even more later, if 50 works. Cheers! |
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51 simultaneous sends (3 pages each) also worked. Next, I'll try around 70 simultaneous within a few days. |
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On this page: https://developers.sinch.com/docs/fax/v2-v3migration/ , under "API Changes", Sinch specifies: "You can still send to multiple recipients, but we will on the backend create multiple faxes and you can follow up on each of them." It seems that when you send a fax to multiple numbers separated by commas Sinch extracts all the numbers and creates a separate fax call to each of them. Unlike Phaxio, who limits the number of recipients to 15, Sinch seems to have no limit for the number of recipients a fax can be sent to. This is another advantage of using Sinch instead of Phaxio, apart from the cheaper phone numbers, cheaper price per sent/received page and the fax-to-email and email-to-fax feature. If you use the email-to-fax feature you can send faxes right from your email client. To enable fax-to-email and email-to-fax in Sinch click on Fax on the left panel > Services > click on the name of the service you use (usually it's "Default Service") > click on the "Fax to Email" tab and add an email address there. If you can't do this it means that it's only available for real fax numbers, not trial numbers. On another note: I tested sending faxes from a mobile device and it works. So, if someone is on the road and only has a mobile phone available and he wants to send an urgent fax, he can open a browser on his mobile (preferably Firefox), navigate to his Nextcloud login page, login, then use Pax Fax like on a desktop to send the fax. I'd be curious to know if you checked how the received faxes looked like, when you sent to 51 numbers. Have you sent the test to at least one number that you control, to see how the received fax looks ? Have you used a test number (like 18882933691 available here: https://www.gotfreefax.com/free-fax-number for non-sensitive fax content) among the recipients' numbers ? |
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It seems that the higher the list of recipients, the longer it takes Nextcloud to return the result message (Success/Error). I have tested 73 simultaneous sends, and Nextcloud was loading for a while, and threw an Error. However, Sinch has received all 73 of them correctly. So perhaps there is some potential improvement to be done on the Nextcloud app side, but its not really necessary. For now, we will limit ourselves to sending about 50 simultaneously, so that there is no error on Nextcloud's side. It is great that we can do it through our phones as well. As for testing how I receive it personally - no, I haven't. The content was sensitive enough that I didn't want to use a public service to check. And I personally don't have a fax machine to check. When we checked in the past with a single send, though, it arrived fine. If I check the individual faxes from a mass send on the Sinch dashboard, the PDF's show up good. Also, since Sinch treats such mass sends as many individual sends, it is reasonable to assume that the recipient receives them as well as a single send. As for the fax-to-email and email-to-fax - I checked it out, and yes, it requires having a number purchased with Sinch. That being said, we are not planning to receive any faxes, and we are currently comfortable using nextcloud to send batches of 50, rather than doing it by email. It is an interesting option though, we will consider it for future reference. Thanks for everything! |
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Renting a real fax number from Sinch isn't hard or irreversible. It's a matter of a few clicks and you can renounce the number at any moment. For professional use I would rent a real fax number so that I can use all the features offered by Sinch and, more importantly, not worry that after a while I will no longer be able to send faxes. Sinch's website doesn't mention if the trial number expires after a specific period of time but it's not impossible to expire some day. Also, if you plan to send faxes to so many recipients, it's very likely some of them will try to send a response back to your fax number and since you are using a trial number that can't receive faxes you will miss those messages. Anyway, the 2 issues mentioned on this thread can be considered solved now. The error that you mention when sending to 73 recipients can be incidental and not caused by the app itself, since the faxes were really sent and the error didn't appear with 51 recipients. If that error comes again, please check Nextcloud's log and your browser's JavaScript console and send us the details. |
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Ok sounds good, thanks! |
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I received a reply from Sinch's support regarding the maximum number of recipients for one fax call. Here it is: "I’ve confirmed that we do not have a limit in place. However, I’d like to note that there is a JSON limitation, which is set at 100." This means that in principle you can enter 100 fax numbers separated by commas in the recipient's number field and the fax will be sent to all. This is much better than Phaxio's limitation to 15 recipients. In a previous message you mentioned that you could see the sent faxes in your Sinch dashboard. This means that you allowed Sinch to store the sent and received faxes. There can be privacy issues associated with letting Sinch store faxes. For example, if you want to make your fax communication comply with HIPAA (Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act), you have to click on Fax > Services > click the name of your fax service (usually "Default Service") > click the "HIPAA Compliance" tab and check the "Don't save outbound faxes" and "Don't save inbound faxes" checkboxes > then click Save. |
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Thank you for confirming that. As for Sinch saving faxes, it is nice to know that we can disable that. I will let our team know. |
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On another note: I've noticed you are interested to send faxes to a lot of recipients simultaneously. Of course, everyone can use our application however they like, but it's good to know that faxes with marketing content sent to recipients without having their prior consent or an already existing business relationship is considered fax spam and there are laws that prohibit it. The legal way of sending marketing material via fax is detailed here: https://www.fcc.gov/consumers/guides/faqs-about-junk-faxes |
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We are not using this service for marketing, advertising or revenue-generating purposes. We are a non-profit and mostly use it for communicating with government and educational facilities. |
| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
|---|---|---|---|
| 2025-04-05 07:33 | titanium | New Issue | |
| 2025-04-05 10:02 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000101 | |
| 2025-04-06 03:03 | titanium | Note Added: 0000102 | |
| 2025-04-06 13:04 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000103 | |
| 2025-04-06 14:07 | titanium | Note Added: 0000104 | |
| 2025-04-25 06:52 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000105 | |
| 2025-04-25 06:55 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Edited: 0000105 | |
| 2025-04-29 05:05 | titanium | Note Added: 0000106 | |
| 2025-05-17 08:23 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000111 | |
| 2025-05-18 16:11 | titanium | Note Added: 0000112 | |
| 2025-05-29 05:54 | titanium | Note Added: 0000113 | |
| 2025-05-29 06:28 | titanium | Note Added: 0000114 | |
| 2025-05-29 09:23 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000115 | |
| 2025-05-29 09:32 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000116 | |
| 2025-05-29 12:22 | titanium | Note Added: 0000117 | |
| 2025-05-29 12:26 | titanium | Note Added: 0000118 | |
| 2025-05-29 12:28 | titanium | Note Added: 0000119 | |
| 2025-05-29 14:13 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000120 | |
| 2025-05-29 14:23 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000121 | |
| 2025-05-29 14:29 | titanium | Note Added: 0000122 | |
| 2025-05-29 14:31 | titanium | Note Added: 0000123 | |
| 2025-05-29 15:07 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000124 | |
| 2025-05-29 15:24 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000125 | |
| 2025-05-29 15:37 | titanium | Note Added: 0000126 | |
| 2025-05-29 15:43 | titanium | Note Added: 0000127 | |
| 2025-05-29 15:51 | titanium | Note Added: 0000128 | |
| 2025-05-29 16:01 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000129 | |
| 2025-05-29 17:00 | titanium | Note Added: 0000130 | |
| 2025-05-29 17:32 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000131 | |
| 2025-05-29 17:39 | titanium | Note Added: 0000132 | |
| 2025-06-02 20:31 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000133 | |
| 2025-06-03 08:05 | titanium | Note Added: 0000134 | |
| 2025-06-06 02:24 | titanium | Note Added: 0000135 | |
| 2025-06-06 05:33 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000136 | |
| 2025-06-06 06:25 | titanium | Note Added: 0000137 | |
| 2025-06-06 09:27 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000138 | |
| 2025-06-06 10:08 | titanium | Note Added: 0000139 | |
| 2025-09-07 16:12 | titanium | Note Added: 0000152 | |
| 2025-09-07 21:39 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000153 | |
| 2025-09-08 03:20 | titanium | Note Added: 0000154 | |
| 2025-09-08 09:06 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000155 | |
| 2025-09-08 09:07 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Edited: 0000155 | |
| 2025-09-08 09:08 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Edited: 0000155 | |
| 2025-09-08 09:11 | titanium | Note Added: 0000156 | |
| 2025-09-09 21:04 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000157 | |
| 2025-09-12 07:01 | titanium | Note Added: 0000158 | |
| 2025-09-12 19:50 | titanium | Note Added: 0000159 | |
| 2025-09-13 04:55 | titanium | Note Added: 0000160 | |
| 2025-09-13 07:36 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000161 | |
| 2025-09-17 05:55 | titanium | Note Added: 0000162 | |
| 2025-09-17 09:00 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000163 | |
| 2025-09-17 09:30 | titanium | Note Added: 0000164 | |
| 2025-09-22 14:15 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000165 | |
| 2025-09-22 14:18 | titanium | Note Added: 0000166 | |
| 2025-09-22 14:30 | DoubleBastionAdmin | Note Added: 0000167 | |
| 2025-09-22 15:02 | titanium | Note Added: 0000168 |
